Potential problems with the 4trak

Forum: 

Hi folks

Heres a contribution to get the forum started...

The wiring loom on the 4trak is clipped underneath the vehicle on the nearside. Just in front of the rear wheel it goes up and over a chassis cross member...on older vehicles it can get chaffed with the constant rubbing on this cross member. Personal experience has shown me that if this happens a major short can occur. This is a potential fire hazzard.11 of the 24 wires that run through the loom melted together on my vehicle causing huge problems with the wiring.
I urge all 4trak owners (especially those who have older vehicles)to check their wiring loom.

Contamination of rear brakes.........Another annoying problem I have experienced is the failure of the rear half shaft oil seals..if this happens axle oil will get into the brake drum and contaminate the brake shoes..instant m.o.t. failure.

Replacement seals are available from Millners for pennies.
You will have to strip down the brake and use a puller to remove the the half shaft..very easy to do.Replacement of seals is a cinch !

I have the full 4trak manual and am willing to help out anyone who needs assistance.

FT Probs

Cheers Mike,

Looks like I will be under the FT again this w/e looking at the wiring.

I'm awaiting a full manual to arrive and then I can really get down to some serious checking.

No problem Pedro.... Oh !.

No problem Pedro....

Oh !.... when I had finished repairing the damage to the loom I protected it from further damage by lagging it with that silvery/grey pipe lagging you can get from B&Q..and cable tied it..worked a treat !!

Fourtrak (Rocky) wiring

Geez, looking under mine, theres no way that wiring should chaff through, assuming it is still clipped in all the correct clips. Unless the chassis/body mount rubbers are so squashed as to reduce the gap between body and chassis. Admitadly, with a 2 1/2 inch body lift, I have no fear of that, but even without it, there should be heaps of room.
My 2 cents worth.
Cheers
David
Growing old is compulsary, growing up isnt, and
MUD MAKES EXCELLENT TOOTHPASTE

Growing old is compulsary, growing up isnt.
MUD MAKES EXCELLENT TOOTHPASTE.
I use billion dollar satellites, to find Tupperware.
Please visit http://groups.msn.com/AussieDaihatsuRocky/_whatsnew.msnw
All views and advice offered are my own, from my ow

dodgy wiring

Well it happened to me David...so I thought I would just urge folks to take a look just in case...My vehicle is old and one or two of the clips had failed admittedly so we had a bit of sagging in places.

Wiring

Had look below my beast yesterday - It seems that all the wiring has been run in flexible corrugated tubing and nicely clipped to the body so no problems there (I hope).

Tried to get the back axle filling plug out that some pr*** had butchered - no luck so far - looks like a drill & tap job (or the blowlamp Evil )

here`s a bagload of potential stuff pinched off forums etc

you can cut and paste onto word to view at your leisure:

I have had this exact same problem and written about it in this forum about 2 months ago. The knocking in third is the sliding synchro hubs and cones moving on the main shaft because the nut that holds them all tight has become loose. Difficulty and grinding when engaging second (especially when changing down from third) is another symptom caused by the synchromesh unit being unable to do its job due to the loose nut. Speaking from experience, I would say look out for the following things:

1. It is a big job to get either gear box or transfer box out due to switches, wires, breather pipes, props and the gear levers etc all being attached. Allow at least a whole day, and drain the oil first.
2. When you lower the transfer box to the ground be prepared to lift the car to get the box from underneath it.
3. The nut is the top one that you will see at the rear of the gearbox. It is 32mm and if damaged costs about £7 !!! from Daihatsu. I think Milner sells them for about £3.
4. The gaskets will almost certainly tear when the two boxes are separated. Again they are expensive from Daihatsu but can easily be cut from a sheet of gasket paper. Use a bit of sealer to ensure no oil leaks.

Hope all this helps.

jez
fourtrak longevity
Mon Dec 10 22:07:07 2001

i`m doing a uni - study on the longevity of "traditional" 4x4`s and have decided to pitch the landrover defender against the fourtrak as a classic dual. Does any one have any tales of abuse / high mileage - or alternatively does anyone have any tales of premature ruin - obviously there`s a wealth of info on the defender but precious little on the daihatsu - which is a pity as they seem well matched with some agricultural occupations actually preferring the 4trak

any info much appreciated

4track
Tue Dec 11 07:56:03 2001

I have 2 Daihatsu 1984 F75 Rockys - one has done 480,000 kms in Australia. Give us a call if you want more info.

Re: fourtrak longevity
Tue Dec 11 08:46:42 2001

IHAVE AN F70 SWB 1988 MODEL FROM ALMOST NEW. IT HAS NOW DONE 130,000 MILES BUT.... AT 107,000 A CRACKED PISTON SEPERATED FROM THE ROD & THE ROD DECIDE TO FIND OUT WHAT THE OUTSIDE WORLD LOOKED LIKE!!!

NEW ENGINE WAS REQUIRED.

ALSO I HAVE HAD THE REAR DOOR HINGES SEIZE UP 3 TIMES
OTHER THAN THAT IT HAS BEEN BRILIANT
Built tough to survive Japan
Tue Dec 11 09:18:12 2001

I think that was a Daihatsu advertising slogan at one time. My 1983 F20 just keeps on going, but it is maintained well. It has done just over 100 000 miles including some pretty tough off-roading in the last 40 000. It has now got to the point where just about every major component needs some attention. But I won't let it die !!!

Fourtrak
Tue Dec 11 10:12:21 2001

I have a 1986 F70 diesel with 114000miles on the clock. I bought it about 18 months ago with 93k. In the past 18 months I have had to carry out the following repairs:

replace one rear wheel bearing
replace rear brake pipes
replace power steering pipe
re-thread steering box 'hole'
rebuild alternator (twice)
replace voltage regulator
replace fan belt
replace power steering belt
new battery

having said that, all the above are 'consumables'. I bought the car real cheap, with no service history at all. The previous owner had a trucking business and told me his mechanic serviced the car. I have changed oil religiously every 4000 miles, and apart from a leaky sump, the car doesn't seem to burn a drop of oil. It has quite bad rust on the driver side door, under the front wheel arches and the bach door is rusted very badly all along bottom.

The engine has never missed a beat, and I've done some pretty long trips in it. Poole (Dorset) to Brussels once, Poole to Dublin via Holyhead twice. All these trips were done at 80mph on the motorway, the Holyhead trips were solid 330 miles with one stop for fuel. The noise in the cab is deafening, so conversations are pretty much out of the question. I've also taken it off road a few times, and it has performed commendably (apart from grounding out once, but I managed to get going under my own steam after a bit).

Where else can you buy a 4x4 which will stay at 80mph for 6hours non-stop, perform off-road, drive around town easily, won't drink too much diesel and still have a fair size engine in it for the kind of money a Fourtrak costs? Parts can be a bit hard to come by, but pattern parts or 'hand-made' can still work out fairly cheap. Besides, there's not alot on the car to go wrong
John.
Re: fourtrak longevity
Tue Dec 11 14:41:04 2001

I had a 1979 F20 which I did 80,000miles in no problems. Just the usual maintenance. What killed it was the rust (fuel tank, chassis, body panels etc etc). Landrovers have an aluminium shell which prevents a lot of the rust problems seen with Daihatsu's. Having said that I've now got a 1986 Fourtrak which has 140,000miles on the clock and will tow anything, cruise at 80mph and still return nearly 30mpg rising to 34mpg if I'm sensible ! It is very reliable (touch wood) and though not exactly comfortable is no worse than a Landrover !! The major difference seems that in the last few years Landrover has taken several huge steps, specifically the TD5 engine giving Daihatsu like diesel performance, suspension systems and the release of the Freelander in competition with the Sportrak.
Parts are another big issue with Landrover parts being easily available everywhere in the world and most countries have a large pattern part industry making Landrover parts. Though parts are more readily available for the Fourtrak than the F20 it is still not, sadly, in the same league as Landrover parts in terms of cost or availability.

paul site owner
Re: fourtrak longevity
Tue Dec 11 21:51:47 2001

i can only echo some of the comment, after having two landrovers , petrol lwb and diesel swb, i am more than happy woth my 2.8td lim edition fourtrak 1991 f75, i have only a small amount of rust on door and wing area, wnere as my landies had knackered chassis. engine on 4trak is 100 times better and as i bought it as i tow car for my caravan and boat, i am more than impressed. i too have off roaded it and it was cool there too. i drive mine like a ferrari and unlike my wife who after two days with landrover , she got the bus back home, she too loves to drive the power assisted 4trak, so much so that we now have two daihatsu cars now in our family. e mail me if i can be of more help thanks paul

reliability
Tue Dec 11 18:56:51 2001

Mines 1990 ftrak (100,000mls)very strong reliable engine,but the floor has got so many holes it looks like something the Ant Hill Mob should be running about in.

4 track longevity
Tue Dec 11 18:08:48 2001

My 1993 four track has done 111 k miles other than consumables it has had a starter motor and new shocks all round.it even has the orignal clutch and rear brake shoes.I defey any land rover owner to say the same about theirs.What engine do they fit in landrovers when it gives up the ghost, Daihatsu.

thanks for the info
Tue Dec 11 19:29:13 2001

smokey - i would certainly like some more info if you`ve got it handy - dont suppose you`ve kept a schedule of bits bought etc have you - yours is by far the highest mileage machine i`ve heard of so i`m very interested

I purchased this vehicle at the end of 1984 and I received it January 3rd
1985 and it now shows 480,000 kms on the clock. It is a Resin top DX model
with a basic gear driven timing gears.
Later models used a belt so running costs are different.

I live in one of the few places in world where an annual MOT is not
required.
You only need one if issued a defect notice by being an idiot or when you
purchase a vehicle
so my vehicle has not had a MOT for 16 years.

I will try to break up the costs as best I can remember them.
Some costs are ongoing, some caused by neglect and others through bad luck.
I will leave you to analyse and categorise them. Most times I source parts
from the wreckers - some are from grey market wrecks - and I fit or repair
myself. My mechanic retired (became a teacher) 5 years ago and I now do
everything myself.

Normal maintenance
New oil, fuel, and air filters annually.
Change water coolant every 2 years and refill with good quality coolant and
50% water.
Change brake pads, rear shoes and brake fluid every 2 years. Wheel and
master cylinders have not ever been overhauled or touched in the vehicles
life It has been driven every day though.
Fan belt every 5 years
Oil changed every 4 months and replaced with diesel engine oil.
Battery - every 5 years - normal N100 battery is very large costs more and
lasts a long time
Tyres - I use Kumho and replace every 100,000 kms
Exhaust system has been replaced twice. ie every 5 years

Body problems
Body is painted over galvanised steel with a fibreglass shell covering the
rear half.
This was one of the first vehicles to use this fibreglass hybrid
contruction.
Body rusts vigorously if the galvanised surface is broken.
Quite often this happens where the panels join at the rear of front doors
and top of cab.
Metal Rear door frame cracks at 150,000 kms. Caused by movement of
fibreglass and door.
Rear door lock required replacing at 300,000 kms through movement of door.
Rubber Hoses on fuel tank rot and require replacing at 300,000 kms - cheap
but a hassle
The driver bucket seat broke at 300,000 kms opposite the recliner mechanism.
Requires disassembly and welding to repair.
Front Seats were reupolstered at 400,000 kms
The recliner mechanism broke last week at 480,000 kms.

Electrical Problems
Biggest hassle is the rear loom rubs on chasis at the back of the vehicle
and is damaged.
This first happened at 100.000 kms. Rear loom was replaced at 300,000 kms
when windscreen wipers kept shorting. Yhis is a known problem with this
vehicle.
Lighting switch assembly required replacing at 300,000 kms. Positive rail of
switch is protected by a relay but the negative rail used by the hi low dip
switch is not and contacts burn out.
This assembly is expensive ($400 Aust).

Engine problems
The DL diesel engine is reliable but requires a regular oil change.
They also have a habit of blowing head gaskets between the water jacket and
the outside world.
The head gasket was replaced several times until I decided that radiator
stop leak was cheaper.
My first motor blew at 200,000 kms. This motor was rebuilt using a DG 2.4
ltr block bored to
2.8 ltr with new liners and pistons. ($2000 Aust)
The original DL head was used with the injectors overhauled by an injector
service centre with new tips ($250 Aust).
At 300,000 kms the glow plugs were replaced - probably did not need to do
this ($120 Aust)
At 350,000 kms alternator stopped charging and was replaced from the
wreckers ($200 Aust)
At 400,000 kms a new water pump was required. ($100 Aust)
The motor is now suffering from low oil pressure and I think it is the worn
valve guides in the original head. I use Shell helix for older motors and it
seems to gum it up ok to get some oil pressure.

Transmission Problems
Biggest hassle is the nut on the end of the main shaft came loose at 100,000
kms requiring the box to be dropped and fixed. ($400 Aust) This is a known
problem.
At 400,000 kms the transfer case siezed through lack of oil. Transfer box
oil leaks into the gearbox through the seal and should be checked every 6
months. ($1000 Aust) Same problem occurs on Toyotas.

Suspension and Steering
I replaced springs and shock absorbers with aftermarket ones when I
purchased the car. ($1400 Aust)
Currently the springs require an overhaul and the shockers are due for
replacement.
The pinion bearings required replacement at 300,000 kms and have not been
done yet because I am slack.

I am sure I have forgotten something but this is all I can remember.
I live 50kms from Melbourne on dirt roads on a 12 acre farmlet.
I am happy with the vehicle and bought another 1984 model for my wife last
year with 200,000 kms on the clock. - genuine I think going by my knowledge.
It is a EX and has power steering and air conditioning. My step son
currently has my car and we share the EX.
s

mike
Re: MPG
Wed Oct 23 16:58:12 2002
62.252.128.7

John

Heres a wee list of potential problems I put together for another prospectivr Trak buyer............

1. Many older traks suffer BADLY from rust...as I mentioned in my posting..check under wheel arches and behind plastic arch trims..also under carpet
in the cabin (do not be afraid to get the seller to lift the carpets..also in the rear end compartment floor behind back seats. Rust within 30 mm of body mounting or seatbelt mounting is an instant M.O.T. failure.

2. Leaking fuel tanks are also a real problem..the steel they used to manufacture them was crap.Its a pain to remove one and repair it ..if it can be repaired (I know cos I've done one)

3.The wiring harness chaffs on a chassis cross member just in front of nearside rear wheel (again this happened to me)..its a potential fire hazzard. If you do buy this car..get some of that polysterene pipe lagging from BandQ and lag the harness at potential friction points.

4. Check all the obvious things work e.g. lights ,horn, heater.indicators,rear window demister, etc.

5,. Have the seller demonstrate 4 wheel drive engagement for you. There is often a problem with the 4wd indicator light in the cabin (it often dont work)..not really a problem as long as 4wd engages..you have to lock the front wheel hubs manually before engaging 4wd.(unless it has automatic hubs)

6. Take the vehicle for a long run (at least 5 miles).Get it it up to 70mph ....listen for any strange knocking noises when changing gear or accelerating/decelarating.In fact any untoward noises at all should raise your suspiscions.I know we are talking old vehicle here..but they can be expensive to repair if there is a major problem. I paid £1000 for my 87 track and promptly spent another grand sorting it out..and its' still a rust bucket Smiling. Make sure TEMPERATURE of engine remains normal and does not overheat.

7. 4trak engines are great..they will go forever if regularly maintained..they require regular oil changes (every 3000 miles)..check for smokey exhaust..get seller to rev
engine hard and you check out the exhaust...if white or black smoke is exsessive..walk away (blueish smoke suggest a set of new glow plugs is required). Remember that emissions are part of M.O.T. test and they are getting stricter (although if it has a recent M.O.T. then it should be ok.You can use engine additives to keep engine clean.

8. If you can ..get under vehicle grab hold of the main propshaft..near the flange where the prop meets differential (rear axle) ..give it a good old yank about..there should be no or very little movement of prop.

9.Check shock absorbers are ok and look at general condition of springs and steering linkages etc..again if it has recent M.O.T. these should be ok.

10. Dont be pressured into buying if you are not happy with anything....there are loads of 4 traks about and its worth finding a good un ! ..try searching on www.autotrader.co.uk for Daihatsu,Fourtrak and see what you come up with..I bet you will be suprised.You can stipulate distance from you, price etc.

Hi folks

Heres a contribution to get the forum started...

The wiring loom on the 4trak is clipped underneath the vehicle on the nearside. Just in front of the rear wheel it goes up and over a chassis cross member...on older vehicles it can get chaffed with the constant rubbing on this cross member. Personal experience has shown me that if this happens a major short can occur. This is a potential fire hazzard.11 of the 24 wires that run through the loom melted together on my vehicle causing huge problems with the wiring.
I urge all 4trak owners (especially those who have older vehicles)to check their wiring loom.

Contamination of rear brakes.........Another annoying problem I have experienced is the failure of the rear half shaft oil seals..if this happens axle oil will get into the brake drum and contaminate the brake shoes..instant m.o.t. failure.

Replacement seals are available from Millners for pennies.
You will have to strip down the brake and use a puller to remove the the half shaft..very easy to do.Replacement of seals is a cinch !

I have the full 4trak manual and am willing to help out anyone who needs assistance.