Forum:
Has anyone apart from me noticed that in the 4x4 problem section on the forum there is an awful lot of people having trouble with sportys rather than fourtraks!!, just goes to show how good a vehicle and reliable the trak is, the bloke in charge in the factory who said "lets stop making the fourtrak" should have been shot, hung drawn and quarter'd!! 
Observant
No the decision maker is not the one who should be shot.
Sportrak's were a lightweight version of the Fourtrak, they were intended for the more youthful end of the market, as such, were constructed from lighter materials, and not intended to be as durable or utilitarian as the Fourtrak. It is indeed, a testament to the sporties good design and construction that it is able to compete against the Fourtrak, and perform so well against it.
Fourtrak design was simple, encompass all the best traits of off road working vehicles and incorporate them into one vehicle, ensure it can tow 3500KG's, and is easily maintained, but have reliability built in, unlike Land Rover.
Market forces and European legislation is what killed both models, European emissions legislation meant new engines would have to be developed for both vehicles, now showing their age, and with subsequent sales declines.
Vehicles were moving on, better handling, cheaper to maintain, better nvh levels (noise, vibration, harshness) and better fuel economy. Due to these factors European sales declined to the point where it became uneconomical to produce them anymore, look at Land Rover, complex engine management systems, Daihatsu would have to follow to meet emissions standards.
Who do we shoot, the European dictatorship, often unelected nobody's; just think how many soldiers died in WWII to stop dictatorship, we now have it by another form. Hitler is laughing in his grave, and we lose more excellent vehicles.
Land Rover
Oh, please God give me a Mk1 Landrover( reword the Janis Joplin track , re- Mercedes Benz). They were built to last forever, though we love our Fourtrak. Just the right height to lift my disabled partner into, and the doors open wide enough. We reguard it as a copy of a MK/2 Station Wagon, with a few twiddley bits.
I would love to have my Mk1 80" back. We would NOT take a modern L/R under any circumstances, have this dream of making a new truck built as as per a MK1 L/R, with no computer controls, no electronic gizmos, just a basic truck , that you can mend with a bent nail and a piece of string. My dream !!!! Yes ,it was slow and not all that comfortable, but I understand that something like 20 per cent of the production is still in use, that must say something about the quality,build and design.
How about a look alike ,keep the body shape, it is a classic, no complicated panels, Pegoet diesel engine, ( spent many years in Africa and Middle East, third world guys could maintian these engines with ease) , Dana axles, built to last, single leaf springs with coil over shocks to enhance ride and capabilities.Larger tyres go up to 7.50 x 16, rather than 6/6.50 x 16, Oh I wish I had the facilitys. I can dream !!!!!! .
Edward (ews) '92 Fourtrak 2.8 TDX
LAND ROVER
I'm afraid it is a case of dream on nowadays. I had a LWB Series 3 LWB with Safari Roof, beast of a vehicle but great fun to drive and exercised the arms at the same time. I'm afraid modern day "replica's" of real 4x4's are full of electronics that kill the challenges and fun of driving. Soon, we are told, steering will go. Already the new Volco will brake if you don't, is this motoring in the 21st century, if it is they can stuff it!!. I loved my Landie and it was the cost of fuel that killed it. I understand it now resides with a Dr in South Africa. In the meantime the Sprotraks will have to do and once they have gone, well perhaps a restoration of a SWB series Landy. Dreams are wonderfull!!!!! but sadly Dreams are all some of us have as we grow longer in the tooth.
OLDMINIMAN
M J Young
must admit after owning a
must admit after owning a lightwieght, a lada niva, driving many older four wheel drives and now owning a 96 fourtrack that sadly the modern day 4x4 is a shadow of what it should be, in the main taking one off road would have the plush carpets ruined within hours, the overhangs and low clearance leaves lots to be desired - and ripped off, yeah they may handle better on the road but hang on why do we buy a 4x4, certainly for me not a `badge` mines a fishing bus that gets me too and from fishing marks, i have resonable comfort, i have the radio and the cabs warm, yesterday i was at deepdale remembering and relearning off road driving in real dire conditions, there i used a new landie thats got the `mapped` ignition systems, nice vehicle, would prob go the same places as i have taken a lightweight possibly more however all those electronic bits are waiting to fail, it does not even have a cable on the trottle now, the anti stall was nice to have, no ifs or buts, my fieldman has its version - a hand throttle lol, allthough i am in no doubt the landrover would get me in and out of more than the fourtrack because of ground clearance i have to temper that with would i ever actually go in those places, deep water possibly, especially if the river i cross to get to one of my fishing marks suddenly floods, however after seeing the range of new `off roads` i doubt they can cope with more than a 1 foot puddle, must admit at 52 i love the power steering, what i fail to understand is why people with so called 4x4`s use road tyres, to me you have just reduced your usefullness by 75%, basically i am sure its a case of `look at me i am big-i am hard dont mess with me`, however nothing beats watching these muppits in a bit of mud or soft ground even snow when you drive past in your old real 4x4, i watched a new think it was v.w try to follow me through the river crossing i go through to go fishing, he got in and failed to climb out as something crunched by the looks of the far bank, he backed out and dissappeared, bet hes is now thinking about how much his all seeing all dancing one legged balerina cost him
4x4 v SPV
I agree with all commentS relating to the modern so called 4x4 and those wth road tyres etc. You must accept that they are now a status symbol, a designer additive for those with too much money.
Who would pay for that huge Porshe Tank, or the BMW with low ground clearance or even the Audi Tank. Like most I am not a badge chaser and on suggesting a Daihatsu to my 40 year old Nephew was looked at as if I's said a Lada Rive or Skoda Estelle. He ended up with a Black Honda CRV with black windows the works, does it go off road, never, sits in the station car park gathering dings from other commuters and their doors. At 56 I remember so many cars that were cars not badges and when cars all looked different and were not computer desigened and engineered, when the trafficator failed to pop out on a Ford Anglia you thumped the B post and out it popped, yes I was a car mad kid then in the late 50's. How would the modern driver cope with vacuum wipers that slowed under acceleration, crossply tyres, and the only lighter for the fag was a match. Cars have progressed a long long way but has the skill of driving or the driving experience improved, I think not. That was driving and making do, if the fan belt broke, off with the wife's stockings and you got home ( carefull no smut please). Now seeing the belts let alone mending them would be an advantage.
Although, in comparison, both the Fourtrak and Sportrak were more advanced than many in the 90's they still did the job and were DIY repairable.Now the electronic wizadry of modern cars and SPV's (4x4's) are just more to go wrong and less fun to drive. Manufacturers have gone too far for their own benifit of after sales servicing and Badges are both a status and designer symbol rather than anything else and at a silly cost.
Before any youngster makes the OAP comment, I restore classic Mini' s and use an Audi A6 for road driving. I live in rural France and the roads suit the 2 Sportraks we have to a tee, rough ,muddy and open ditches and I do venture off road to chase the chickens home. What we will do when they finally give up is probably get an old Landrover Series 2 or 3 not a modern replacement
NO OFFENCE IS MEANT OR INTENDED BY MY PERSONAL COMMENTS...EVERY ONE TO THEIR OWN.
OLDMINIMAN
M J Young
i hat modern awd
Couldnt agree with you all more, im young compared to some of you, but i dont want creature comforts, i dont want electrical stuff, it all goes wrong, the old square 4x4's look like the job, i love land rovers and would have an old 90 defender if i could afford one, but to be honest i think the datsu is better for me all round - cheap as chips too, i dislike all new landrovers now apart from the defenders, they are just as bad as the rest of these poncy awd's, i wont say 4x4 cos there all electric on demand tosh - where is the fun in that, people dont drive anymore, there vehicles do, sorry but i trust a solid lump of metal more than i do a microchip (hmm must be dinner time).
Full of ideas but no time to do them!!
www.bloodredoffroad.com
www.milneroffroad.com
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youtube: Redfourtrack
AWD's
Good on you mate....hope you had a good dinner!!
OLDMINIMAN
M J Young
Observant
Well said Assasin!!!!
I have 2 Sportraks and have owened the first since 1995 and if the total costs for replacement parts are over £500 during 100K miles I would be surprised. Both the Sportraks and the Fourtracks were excellent reliable vehicles and the replacement for the Sportrak was no where near as good. The Fourtrak was voted best off roader for years and it is a great shame that such vehicles have now gone and been replaced by SPV's that are used for school runs and shopping trips. They cost a fortune to buy and maintain and in some cases their off road capabilities are rubbish and most never see grass let alone Mud!!. If they do with all the electronics like ESP etc the experience has gone of real off roading.
I,for one, mourn the loss of both vehicles, they were excellent for what they were provided for but as assasin points out EEC regulations and the so call "Greenhouse" & "Green Brigade" syndrome has forced them off the road. In the later days of production in order to cut costs Daihatsu scrimped in tiny parts which often make the later car less reliable and certainly less comfortable, in my experience of owning a 1991 and a 1996 version, both still going strong here in France.
Remeber it was this legislation that killed the Mini and allowed the BMW Mini to take on it's name, and yes I'm sure if those who died in both wars knew how much of UK industry has been hived off to the Europeans, no offence intended, then I expect they would have considered twice. I think if they were able to look at the immigration policies of the UK they would never have laid their lives down for such a dictatorship. Yes I live in France but a lot of the, so called, EEC rules and regulations that the UK introduce as EEC driven are never apparent or applied here, so who is pulling whose chain?????
OLDMINIMAN
M J Young
QUOTE..... snip ....I
QUOTE
..... snip ....
I think if they were able to look at the immigration policies of the UK they would never have laid their lives down for such a dictatorship. Yes I live in France but a lot of the, so called, EEC rules and regulations that the UK introduce as EEC driven are never apparent or applied here, so who is pulling whose chain?????
OLDMINIMAN
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I drag this one out every now and again.
My Grandfather, whom I remember from when I was small as a pretty cantankerous old boy, spent 4 years in a WW1 POW camp (no Geneva Convention in those days) in Eastern Germany, having been captured in the first weeks of the war (he was one of the professional soldiers before WW1). Funnily enough, I still have his dog-tag with the bullet hole in it. Ironically, were it not for this bullet, my grandad would likely as not have been mown down in the years of trench warfare that followed and, as a consequence, I wouldn't be around now!
If he knew that Britain was to be ruled by a bunch of lilly-livered French and German politicians with their noses in a huge unaudited trough, I'm pretty sure that the Anglo-Saxon would be fruity and that he would set about starting WW3 there and then !
Quote
I agree but then all politicians regardless of nationality are all having their fat noses in the trough of our taxes. They all end up rich like Blair, Prescott and the like, whom, bear in mind, were supposed to have Socialist values....sure! They are all in it for what they can get out of it and sod Jo public who foots the bill.
My main comments were intended to say that whilst the UK introduce laws giving the excuse that they are EU driven, other countries in the EU do not introduce such laws, so are they just using the EU as a scape goat for their policies or are they applying the EU laws rigidly when it suits whilst other countries interpret the same laws to suit themselves... we will never know all I know is that some EU rules enforced by the UK are not enforced in other EU Countries. I thinks you also have to bear in mind that the EU is not just ruled by the French and the Germans, those like Mr and Mrs Niel Kinnock are two of the highest paid commissioners in the EU and their beliefs likewise were supposed to be socialist. The Uk government and their EU Commissioners and EMP's are all as much to blame and all have their heads in the huge unaudited trough of all our taxes and are wealthier than ever for it. Who else like MP's,can secure a full Pension after being unelected having served for just 15 years valued at half their salaries? Who else can emplot their relations at huge salaries for doing nothing, no bugger apart from MP's.
OLDMINIMAN (Apologies Lurch POLITICS again)
M J Young
Fourtrak Pesto
Here's an interesting one to add to the debate, in Italy, due to their laws on engine capacities over 2.0 litres being exhorbitantly taxed, an Italian company devised a new Fourtrak derivative.
Buying Fourtrak's up from the manufacturer, minus their engines, they fitted the BMW six cylinder 2.0 litre petrol units to comply with the taxation legislation, and not incur these exhorbitant taxes. With these units, they became extremely popular, they performed better in most circumstances than the original diesel unit and were extremely capable both on and off road, the durability and reliability of the BMW petrol unit meant many are still in existance. BMW engined vehicles performed better on road with startling performance as this engine could be obtained in various power outputs, this, and the combination of low gearing meant they surprised many hot hatches of the day in the traffic light grand prix.
Makes you think? which of my contacts can get me a 4.4 V8 Beemer engine to throw in a Fourtrak? Hmm Hmm Hmm.
BMW engined Fourtrak
Hi.
There are posts and pics re this alternative Fourtrak on the site, though the name escapes me at present,even though I made a post about it. I believe a member owns one.
ews
Edward (ews) '92 Fourtrak 2.8 TDX
BMW Fourtrak
The truck was called a 'Bertone Freeclimber' BMW 2.71, owner/menbers login was 'legin'. Just checked my old post's.
Edward (ews)
Edward (ews) '92 Fourtrak 2.8 TDX
less fourtraks, more chelsea tractors
a sad day indeed,
i will second that
I have had my fourtrak for almost two years and put it in for its second mot today and all it failed on wose the tail pipe.Thats what i call good.So put them in front of the firing squad and get the fourtraks back
.