Forum:
I've been mulling over oil recently... The recommended oil for both my Sirion Rally IV and my YRV Turbo is 5W 30. What got me thinking however, is the cold cranking/winter grade vs. my new country of domicile, as climate is an important factor...
Back in the UK, my Sirion ran 5W 30, as being a modern engine in a colder climate, this oil's well suited. Now that I'm based in New Zealand however, the cold cranking range isn't as necessary, as the temperatures out here are no-where near as cold (I don't think I'll ever see frost where I live, put it that way). Therefore, as my engine warm up cycle will be less stressful on the engine, should I run a 10W 30, which is more suited to higher-reving performance engines?
What about going to a 10W 40? Given the higher temperatures we experience out here, would this be better given the higher temperature designation?
Both cars don't do mega miles (normally around 5,000 a year), and as the YRV needs a service, I'm in a state of quandary, and would appreciate some opinions...
Advice not opinions
What you need grogs is advice not opinions.
The cars' handbooks will give you temperature range advice. Additionally you should go to the NZ websites of oil suppliers. They should give advice on oil choice for your environment, by car.
So if you want my opinion, seek advice. Sorry to be in a non-debating mode today!
YRV Tony
Opinions are like...
Well, you know the saying...
Actually, I'm after peoples opinions so that I can formulate my own based upon their views.
As for checking handbooks, one's for a UK market car, and the other's in Japanese being an import. Websites in NZ are not as comprehensive as in the UK, and motor factors/oil companies will simply shake their heads as both cars are imports, and they'll take the easy route by saying they don't know...
One of many
Is it advisable to form an opinion when there's plenty of web data on similar models in NZ?
This is one of many sources of NZ data I found in a couple of jiffs on the web.
http://www.datateck.com.au/lube/caltx_nz/Default.asp
Also, the handbooks even in Japanese surely show ambient temperature range charts which prescribe Daihatsu's oil recommendations.
YRV Tony
stick to 5w30
stick to 5w30 or you can go 0w30. I'm in Malaysia and its 30C +/- 5C all year round, the Perodua Myvi (Daihatsu Sirion rebadge) is factory spec to run 5w30. Most modern engines use thinner engine oils citing better fuel efficiency. Toyota cars such as the Yaris is spec to run 0w20 in the states.
Daihatsu YRV Turbo powered - myviturbo.com
Opinions!
Thanks to all who added their opinions, I shall go away and mull this over in my mind... I suppose even if a 5W 30 is overkill on cold starting, it'll still fly around the engine better than a 10W, and at least I'm keeping with OEM spec... Personally, I've never been a fan of 0W grade oils, as I used to own a Lancer Evo IV many years ago, and my mechanic was a guru on all things Evo (he prepped rally cars etc), and said that 0W was too thin. Fair enough that we're talking different engines, power etc, but it's stuck in my mind and won't go away now...
Bob, I stared at the engine bay for a while and concluded that my local mechanic would be a better option... It took him half-an-hour, whereas I'd still be doing it, have no skin left on my hands, and a temper like The Hulk!!!
myviturbo.com - Whereabouts in Malaysia are you?
Then your mechanic knew
Then your mechanic knew nothing regarding oil!. He should know that the second number is the oils grade at running temp..
0w 40 identical to 10w 40 once hot.
You can now even get 0w50 and 0w 60 in Japan
Oil be back...
Oh but he did, and he has a very good rep in the industry, and is very well known... But anyway, cheers for your input.
Evo's and Scoobies best
Evo's and Scoobies best protection on 50 or even 60 grade oils. 5w50 or 10w50 for example
He probably said no to using 0w's as these were until recently only available in 30 and 40 grades only.
Here is the new oil from Japan, 0w 50.
http://www.eneos.us/product/2
Just a shame we don't have it easily available in UK yet, as it's best of both worlds, superior cold flow and decent hot viscosity.
Evo's, Oil, and more Oil...
Yeah, I used Mobil 1 Motorsport in mine...
As for Eneos 0W 50, it's already available in the UK... Just go here:
http://www.japarts.co.uk/shop/?sh=oil
We'll probably get it in about 10-years or so!!!
Incidentally, if anyone's interested, this is the selection that I have to choose from...
http://www.supercheapauto.co.nz/online-store/engine-oils/synthetic-oils/synthetic-oils.aspx?id=60103
As an example of the difference, we don't even get Magnatec in 5W 30 like back in the UK (and especially not at £17.50 like it is Halfords at the moment!!), and just have 2 versions of Mobil 1 compared to the newer versions back in the UK. It makes for interesting choosing as I don't exactly have many 'ideal' choices to choose from (hence the post!!)...
I would not pay those prices
I would not pay those prices for 4;litres. Halfords is ridiculours even with my Trade card.
My oil supplier sells 20 litres drums of 5w 40 GULF fully syn or 10w 60 Gulf "Racing" for £45 delivered, And 12x1 litres of Shell helix Ultra 5w40 for £32.99 (£14 each in Shell garages)
Prices
LOL, thanks for rubbing those prices in, not like I have much choice really! NZ only has a population of less than 4.5 million, so economies of trade are not what they are back in the UK (no Opie oil equivalent etc). Even independent motor factors don't seem to exist...
I'd like nothing more than to have a 20 gallon tub at the back of my garage full of synthetic... However, in the grand scheme of things, I'd rather be here in NZ and pay more for my oil if you know what I mean!
I do indeed. NZ is a great
I do indeed. NZ is a great country to be living in.
Shelf life
The problem with the price-ideal situation of buying oil in bulk is that it has a shelf life. Oil slowly oxidises on its own, let alone in an engine.
Comma (a division of Exxon/Mobil) give a shelf life of 5 years I think it is, by which time it's presumably on the knockings of just good enough for the worst operational conditions they can envisage.
Oil is at its best when first manufactured, and thus past its best more and more as it ages.
Depressing eh?
YRV Tony
Comms's 5 years is really
Comms's 5 years is really quite conservative and likely a worse case storage scenario.
Mobil 1 (USA) and others (shell I think) state up to 10 years if oil kept sealed and in dry and decent temperature conditions.
As long as you give a bottle/tub a good shake up before I very much doubt you will ever have any probs.
I've used oil that's was likely over 10 years old, was stored well and kept in the house. If it looks good when pouring, no solids. Then it is fine.
Of course, Don't use oil if it appears hazy (moisture) or has any solids.
20 litres I can use up in 12-18 months, servicing 2 cars.
But I do change oil very often, every 2000-3000k, and even sooner for the GTti. Cheap peace of mind that engine is clean and free of sludge/sticking piston rings.
I'm in the capital city,
I'm in the capital city, Kuala Lumpur. As you know, The Sirion M301 is rebadged as Perodua Myvi here, and its exported to Indonesia and sold as a Daihatsu Sirion.
What I am stating is not an opinion, not an advice. Its solid facts stated in the owner's manual to use 5w30.
Unless your mechanic used to be the chief engineer who designed the K3-VE engine. forget what your mechanic says, he did not design, engineer and build the engine. Daihatsu did. The K3-VE engine is NOT a Toyota design, its a Daihatsu design. So follow what Daihatsu says.
I've tried 0w20 on my engine before, no gain in fuel efficiency, and engine sound less refined. So I went back with 0w30.
Daihatsu YRV Turbo powered - myviturbo.com
Never a truer word
Most people, even the best mechanics, don't have a clue about the real mathematical and engineering complexity of the design of most things, including vehicles and their components.
YRV Tony
KL
I didn't want to assume you were from KL (for example, everyone I meet assumes I'm from London as I'm British), but there was a pretty good chance... Great city, spent about a week there, staying to the South of Petaling (Jalan Sultan) in 2005. Nothing like some chicken rice followed by a monsoon in the evening!!
I know what you're saying about using the manufacturer recommended oil (although you're even contradicting that by using 0w 30...), and I have already decided to go with that spec, so fear not, fresh blood of the 5w 30 variety will be flowing shortly...
Visit us again
Come by again, there's more to KL than just chicken rice.
Get a local to bring you around and the cuisine will blow your mind (either in a good way or culture shock way, lol).
I'm using 0w30 because of an article I read which was written neither by an engineer or mechanic. LOL. But it made perfect sense to me, so I'll risk it with my own car, but I won't give advice to others to do the same.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/
I use Amsoil SSO specifically. Full synthetics.
Daihatsu YRV Turbo powered - myviturbo.com
In Taiwan.
I've got an old car, so I assume the clearances aren't as close as on a more modern engine. I'm skeptical of 0W oils in general, doubt they have much benefit here in Taiwan, and very much doubt they have any benefit for my 26 year old car.
I've been running Mobil Delvac MX (15W40) but have recently become aware that oils primarily intended for diesels have now also been downgraded by the reduction in zinc levels.
The best I can do at the moment is to use the oldest spec APA oil I can find, which here in Taiwan is a straight 40W SJ produced by CPC, the national petroleum corporation, which I was already using in my motorcycle.
Once the summer heat dies down a bit I might switch to a CPC 20W50 SJ. These old-spec oils probably won't be available much longer though.
Multigrades achieve the high numbers using viscosity improvers which I've been plausibly told are relatively poor lubricants, and shear badly in a motorcycle transmission, though this probably isn't such a big problem with a car. Wide range multigrades use more VI's.
I hope to install a prelube system which would, I think, tend to eliminate any advantage that 0W oil might have.
If I also install secondary filtration (another "planned" upgrade), I may change to Mobil1 15W50 since it seems to have a decent amount of zinc, if these 2011 specs are still current.
http://www.mobil.com/usa-english/motoroil/files/mobil_1_product_guide.pdf.
Dont be skeptical of 0w (or
Dont be too skeptical of 0w (or 5w) with synthtics. Even a 0w is still heaps thicker at start up than any engine wants to be pumping. (Compared to 30/40/50 oil thinness at operating temps)
Modern synthetics are able to reach the wide viscosity ranges without needing as much viscosity improvers...Trying to get a mineral oil to perform properly with such wide grades is just not possible, Hence why you cannot fine 0w40, 5w 50 in mineral or even semi-syn.
With minerals, Use the most narrow visocisty band as possible, like 10w30, 15w40, 20w40 (rare)
I really cannot see any reason these days to use a straight non-multigrade engine oil such as 30 or 40, in anything except a lawnmower or tractor or historic vehicle.
Yes you are correct that most newer oils do not have as much zinc, which gives good top end lubrication such as camshaft. But the benefits of faster oil flow plus alternative additives is proving not to be causing any issues.
Valvoline "Racing" 5w 50 synthetic does still have high zinc levels, as does Comma Motorsport. Both fine oils but due to the higher zinc I don't think they meet the very latest API/ACEA specs.
Interesting...
Just popped in to my local oil shop to discover that we (as in, down here) do a 0w 50 as well...
http://imageshack.us/a/img69/917/img20120914145650.jpg
25% of this weekend too, so debating between Castrol Edge 5w 30, Valvoline 5w 30, the new Valvoline 0w 50, or, maybe something from the 0w 40 range.
To much choice to be honest...
Blimey cool, And 5w 60 as
Blimey cool, And 5w 60 as well!
0W 40 i would say, can't see the K3-VE2 engine wanting anything thicker. 50 or 60 and you are losing a little power/economy from the thicker viscosity.
Indeed!
I too was impressed to see these new oils over here, and they're not that badly priced in comparison to what we have to pay for oil.
As for my final choice, I'm going to head in there with 5w 30 in mind. If there's an offer for a 0w 40, then I'll ponder between the two and make up my mind then...
As for the 5w 60, that'll make for an interesting choice when I change the oil on my Alfa 3.2 V6. Alfa recommend 10w 60, so again, I'll be seeing what's on offer when I arrive with an oil purchase in mind! Plus a bit of net research of course...
Yeah these alfa engines want
Yeah these alfa engines want a 50 or 60 grade. 10w or 15w was only specified because 5w60 was not available few years ago.
Probably cheaper and better than the Selenia stuff as well!
Doh!
Double posting mayhem ensues...