Forum:
We have a starter problem with our '97 F78 Fourtak. The starter is not engaging and there are two seperate noises. One is coming from what I thought was the starter relay on the offside wing behind the battery but which I now understand is the glow plug relay. With the ignition on it makes a continuous noise like a 12V air compressor! I have checked this relay with an independent 12V supply and it makes the correct single clunk when powered up. The other noise is coming from the starter itself and sounds like a relay trying to engage. After trying, the dash lights disapear but come back after a short while. The battery is newish and fully charged. I was about to order a new starter but was thrown by the glow plug relay issue, it all happened at the same time with no prior indication of problems. The glow plugs were replaced a year ago. Is there a seperate starter relay somewhere or is it integral with the starter motor? The earth connection to the engine appears sound. The only earth connection I can see to the body is the relatively small one direct from the battery to the inner wing. Is there another somewhere between the engine and the chassis? We live in Spain and Daihatsus are thin on the ground here as is expertise in fixing them so if anyone can throw any light on these problems and point me in the right direction I would be extremely grateful.
Thanks DavidT
I have the service manual
I have the service manual for the F70,F75 and F77, but NOT the F78.
For the above series (2.8 turbo and non-turbo diesel), not sure about F78, the starter has a pre-engage solenoid above the motor proper (part of the same unit). This solenoid has two coils in it - a powerful coil to pull the shaft into engagement, and a holding coil to keep it there. The system dis-engages the pull-in coil and uses the holding coil to keep it there.
It maybe that some contacts within the solenoid are dirty (have you been in deep water?). BTW I inquired about a new (recon?) starter - I think we are talking about £200+?
I can send some diagrams if u PM me your email address, if you don't have any luck elsewhere.
1985 Veg oil burning Fourtrak "Rocky".
1985 Veg oil burning Fourtrak "Rocky".
Thanks for your comments and
Thanks for your comments and offer of diagrams. I have a copy of the same manual although the sscans on mine are not very good. I have never seen a manual offered for the F78. Use has been normal road use. Could you review my comment to the previous post and let me have any thoughts.
In 120,000 plus miles this is the first failure we have experienced so I really can't complain, we just need to get the old girl fixed and go on enjoying her.
Many thanks.
David T
fourtrak starter problem spain
on the back of the starter is a shuttle solenoid, when you turn the key this throws a shuttle to make contact with the power lead connection from the battery thus making a circut which in turn throws the starter. you can hear the shuttle being thrown but the contact at the end of it is to grubby to make a good contact.
un-bolt starter on the end is a small triangle cover held by 3 screws, take this off u will see a shuttle. this is what is thrown forward to make contact with the copper washer at the end, this then allows the battery current to continue to the starter. the copper washer is what needs to be cleaned, i.e wire-wool. my friend has done this to his vehicle and cured the problem, hope this helps and works for you.
happy motoring daihatsu steve u.k.
Thanks Steve. The issue with
Thanks Steve. The issue with the glow plug relay is making me wonder if perhaps I have a current supply problem which is why I started thinking about the earth connections. It's as if there is insufficient current to the glow plug relay, hence it chatters continuously trying to hold open. Could it be a fault in the starter is drawing so much power that this is simply a side effect? Usually all is normal when I first try to start, then the glow plug relay starts chattering almost immediately I try to engage the starter. If I swich off and then on again the glow plug relay kicks in with the ignition before trying to engage the starter. If I leave it for a minute or so the cycle then repeats.
David T
If you have the same service
If you have the same service manual as me, you should look at ST-23 and the fault finding flow chart on ST-25 - I think you are going to need to check all the specified voltages in the flowchart.
Check all the earths and connections to and from the relay timer and the current sensor on the glow plugs. I assume all your glow plugs are ok?
1985 Veg oil burning Fourtrak "Rocky".
1985 Veg oil burning Fourtrak "Rocky".
Thanks again. Looks like I'm
Thanks again. Looks like I'm going to have a busy weekend!! I have made some enquiries here locally in Spain to see if I can source a replacement starter should I need one. No one here lists the F78, only the earlier 2.8 TD models upto '93. Do you by any chance know if the starters are the same pre and post ,93?
David T